Ariff Alfian Rosli, a 28-year-old Malaysian man whose family reported him missing after he stopped contacting them three years ago, has been “found” after pictures of his civil partnership ceremony in Ireland emerged on the Internet last week. The news has made the headlines in Malaysia and criticism of his civil union has been harsh.
In a set of photos uploaded on Facebook, Ariff is seen wearing a black baju Melayu with headgear, while his spouse – identified in the media as Jonathan – is in a tuxedo. It is not known when the ceremony was held although the photos were uploaded on December 16 – the same day a Facebook “Public Figure” page bearing the man’s full name was created.
Ariff originally moved to Ireland in 2003 to study medicine at University College Dublin under a Petronas sponsorship programme. Petronas, which stopped sponsoring Ariff in 2009, is reportedly demanding repayment for the RM890,000 (USD280,000) it paid for his education in Ireland.
According to media reports, his father had lodged missing person reports with the police, Malaysia’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the Irish and Malaysian embassies in both countries. Ariff’s parents have also reportedly made eight trips to Ireland in the past two years but failed to locate him.
Ariff has however told The Irish Times he was not missing, and that the Irish authorities and Malaysian embassy are aware that he is residing in Ireland legally.
Free Malaysia Today, an independent news website, reported on Monday that a NGO, Kepong Islamic Youth Organisation (PBIK), has made a police report “in the name of the Malays against a Malay youth who disgraced the name of our country, religion and race.”
“We want to pressure the Higher Education Ministry and government-linked companies which sponsors students for education abroad to ensure that the students’ Malayness and Islamic identity are strong,” said PBIK chairman Norizan Ali was quoted as saying. “Malaysian Muslims must adhere to the Islamic laws and our country’s laws even when they are abroad.”
He added that PBIK intends to provide a copy of the police report to the Federal Territory Islamic Affairs Depart¬ment (Jawi) to urge it to take action against the man if he returned to Malaysia. Under Malaysian laws, same-sex sexual relationships are punishable by up to 20 years in prison.
The same report quoted Malaysian ambassador to Ireland Ramli Naam who confirmed that Ariff’s whereabouts is known but is unable to reveal the information as it was against Ireland’s Data Protection Act.
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I'm glad he is in Ireland now. 20 years jail sentences for same-sex relationship in Malaysia is too much. Hope the best for you!!
Anyway he did the right thing.. if he gets ostracised for marrying a man in his native country then get it done outside. Life is short and he has every right to pursue his happiness. Don't worry these scums in malaysia cant do anything as its outside their jurisdiction. Just brush them aside like crazy dogs ...
In malaysia, we have a chief minister who raped an underaged girl, another minister who molested his maid and those who walked the corridors of power are on the take to the tune of billions of dollars... and these scums cant make a sound ! Another guy marrying another guy, they shook the whole country?
the wedding picture is so sweet, i always dream of this for myself, i wish their relationship last forever!
Of course, the reaction of the massively corrupt Malaysian government shows just how fractured it has become, both racially and religiously - the Thought Police are in high gear, even the dispatch of an "advisor" to Dublin - I hope the Garda (Irish Police) are watching the movements of that person like a hawk.
The Malaysian government response also guarantees that Ariff will never be returned to Malaysia - the death threats, prison sentence, false claims of fraud et.c.
Anyhow, congratulations, my best wishes to you both.
congrats!wish both of you all the best!
other than that: congrats to both of them. Hope all decisions make are going to be worth it. cheers :)
The only issue I have is probably about his scholarship. I don't know what his scholarship conditions entail etc, but he shouldn't break the agreement without thinking about the consequences. His dad is a retired naval officer and is probably the guarantor for his scholarship and if he did break the agreement, it probably means his dad has to pay everything back and that's a lot of money especially since his father is retired. I would know because I too am a scholarship student and my dad is also retired :3 hehe. Really hope he would pay back the scholarship or at least honour the agreement or something.
Good luck to them both.
where is the sense responsibility?
the only headlines in the news will be: malaysian muslim malay guy did same sex civil partnership in Ireland.... not 'missing'
running away from problems will never solve anything, it makes things worst...
- Tuesday, December 20, 2011
Malaysian Muslims seek action over man 'missing' in Ireland
A MALAYSIAN student who reportedly had a civil partnership with an Irishman has been caught up in a political storm of controversy in his home country.
Ariff Alfian Rosli (28) has been resident in Ireland since moving here eight years ago to study medicine at a university in Dublin.
After an apparent disagreement with his son in 2009, Mr Rosli’s father reported him missing to Malaysian authorities.
In recent days, pictures emerged on the internet which appeared to be of Mr Rosli in traditional Malaysian dress with his civil partner in Ireland at an event at Dublin City Hall.
The pictures were published on the front pages of some local newspapers and have been the source of criticism from numerous political groups in Malaysia, where same-sex sexual relationships are illegal and punishable by up to 20 years in prison.
The Malaysian police have been urged by Muslim groups to investigate the issue on the basis that Mr Rosli has failed to adhere to the country’s Islamic laws.
The controversy has prompted the Malaysian prime minister’s office to issue a statement pledging to investigate the matter.
An official from Malaysia’s ruling political party is reportedly due to arrive in Dublin later this week to convince Mr Rosli to return home.
Mr Rosli yesterday told The Irish Times he was not missing and wished to correct inaccurate comments about him in the Malaysian media.
“I am not missing. The Irish authorities know I am legally resident here. The Malaysian embassy has also been aware for several years that I am residing here legally,” he said.
“I feel I have have been inadvertently thrust into the public eye. I just want to get by without upsetting anyone or causing any trouble. My overriding concern is for my family.”
He declined to comment on whether he had a civil partnership or was involved in a same-sex relationship. Homosexuality is still a taboo issue in Malaysia.
Advocates for gay rights say many Malaysians remain afraid to come out publicly for fear of religious condemnation or prosecution.
Mr Rosli also said reports that he had renounced his Muslim faith were inaccurate.
“I have not converted to any religion, contrary to what has been reported. I was born a Muslim, I am still a Muslim and will remain a Muslim ’til the day I die. Nothing will shake me from my faith.”
He also said he was in regular contact with his family and was baffled at how his “disappearance” had become a major source of controversy in his home country. However, he has not spoken with his father – a retired naval officer – for several years.
“I had a disagreement with my father in 2009, after which he reported me missing . . . I’m not in communication with him, but I am in regular contact with my other family members,” he added.
xxxxx
Petronas? Really? This money is nothing to this company. God they even have an F1 Team. Talk about throwing money into an inferno.
Stop being lead around by your nose rings folks.
My husband bailed out on Singapore many years ago. He chose to leave everything behind and I mean everything. This choice was not an easy one.
I left the United States the country I proudly served in the Marine Corps and would have laid my life down for my country the one that would not allow me to be who I am or with whom I choose.
Until any of you have the balls to fight or make tough choices you really haven't a clue.
You think it is easy to not talk to your father any longer? To watch my husband beg and cry on the phone while I was called "satan" by his father was a gut wrenching experience bar none.
Malaysia is no different than any other place. We are hated world wide. Take the blinders off and have a real look around. Accept it or fight is your choice.
We fought and we got very lucky. We have been here in Canada now for almost eight years and it was not a picnic. Yeah gay marriage is law here but we still endured a five and a half year immigration battle.
This young man has balls, he chose what some call the easy path... yeah fraud that was all he had on his mind. Come on. Think about never being able to go home again, ever. Your family is sick and dying and they want to see you but you can't go. The houses are being sold as they die your past is being erased into oblivion. The only thing you can trust is your other half. That is all you have. That is what we endured and that is what he is now having to deal with along with a whole slew of religious doctrine.
My heart goes out to both of them. BRAVO! They know what true love is.
THAT IS ALL THERE IS IN THE END.
If gay people who are familiar with the oppression of gay people in Malaysia (and by families everywhere) cannot understand that a culturally appropriate newpaper article which panders to Islamic tradition is VERY unlikely to have the facts right, (or to have all the facts), and is likely to have an homophobic bias. The newspaper's attempt to frame love and marriage as fraud and theft should not be accepted at face value.
The stupidity of gay people who buy this story and fail to see that this is an attempt to link being gay with dishonorable behavior has to rest in their own denial of the nastiness of the cultural context in which it is set. This story is not about the money and there is NO link between being gay, falling in love, and theft. The context of the story is the culture of Malaysia informed by Islamic values and Shariah law.
The story is really about how the oppression of gay freedom can have unexpected consequences. Fortunately the Malaysian newlywed will be better able to assist in achieving a fair financial outcome if he is based in Ireland (and not Malaysia where his life would likely be ruined - not for his default on a loan - as this has no doubt happened many times before) - BUT FOR HIS OPENLY GAY MARRIAGE. If you think he gained the scholarship and attended medical school to steal a scholarship you need your head read.
So this case will now be used as a justification to force more young Malaysians deep into the closet if they hope to ever receive a scholarship to study abroad. What a disgrace! Instead of understanding how backward and stultifying the oppressive culture is, and encouraging more loving and closer families, this will divide them more and likely result in more teen suicides.
If you don't understand the connection, get yourself checked.
Look at yourself, young man, we are all raised in homophobic societies and we all absorb homophobia. As we mature, if we can do so with a willingness to learn, we see more and more of our internalized homophobia and can try to overcome the prejudices and biases...or at least keep them in check.
You can claim "gay and proud" all you like but you are not giving a gay person the benefit of the doubt (which every legal system would). Nor are you applying standards equally in light of context (gay oppression).
The behavior of the newlywed may have been emotionally spurred by his father's outrageous homophobia - do you blame his father and say he deserves to be stuck with the debt? Nope, but of course we don't have facts beyond newspaper articles.
You ask about completion of studies. This is a red herring. After what the young man went through, maybe we should just be glad he didn't commit suicide and that he may have found a "happily ever after" in Ireland. These things are complex, but for a gay man to simply accept the arguments of a newspaper pandering to an oppressive culture is really sad.
Who knows...maybe he really wants to be a physician and will continue his studies later. Wouldn't be the first student to take leave of absence.
Gay Malaysians in Ireland seem to be both upset and angry about this story - for obvious reasons - while we Irish are bemused at this story! An elderly, senior, Straight colleague of mine - and nobody thinks I'm gay, not that I hide it - remarked on it at lunchtime, saying: "Do those lads [the Malaysian government] not have better things to do with their time?" Quite.
It is far, far too intrusive - the thought that a government would start spying on its citizens abroad, and trying to detect if they're gay or not - in which case, they 'should' be punished, or called home for 'questioning'.
What utter nonsense!
Although the Irish are not fully welcoming of gay men and women, at the same time, they're mostly not very bothered about gay people, and in any poll, a clear majority support and welcome gay rights, with the Irish government, police and other bodies working to create an inclusive society, and it's one where discrimination against gay people is illegal.
As such, I can say that most ordinary, plain, decent Irish people would frown at the thought of the Malaysian government interfering with its citizens rights abroad - an unheard of matter, here - and that this story can be expected to run again in further depth, should the Malaysian government press ahead with its (reported) foolish plan to send officials to Ireland to look for this guy.
They may as well send Secret Policement to try and arrest every immoral Irishman while they're at it - and the packed, busy gay bar (one of a few in Dublin) that I just left an hour ago, full of openly gay men and women, as well as Straights, would keep them busy for quite a while.
Finally, I should point out that the photo above was taken at City Hall, the administrative heart of Dublin City Council, and one of the key heritage spots in Dublin and, indeed, Ireland. During the 1916 uprising against the British, the then masters of Ireland, people fought and died in the street outside this building, and it's one of the key institutions that represents human and civil rights in modern Ireland.
The fact that a gay 'marriage' - or civil ceremony ' is being held in the photo above (and I know That room very well, myself) - underlines the support that the Irish government, and, in general, the Irish people, have for gay rights, today.
As such, any Malaysian delegation looking to find 'deviant' and 'immoral' citizens abroad should not expect to get one of the famous Irish welcomes from us, as a people, or as a political body...
People leave. They emigrate. They make new lives in new countries and cultures. Should I point at a couple of my best friends - one Chinese guy from the mainland, here about 12 years, and one from Hong Kong, here about 8 years - and ask them what the hell they're doing here in Ireland for so long - and especially as they're both Still single, and don't 'even' have a partner to keep them here?!
What a silly thing to say! People leave the comfort of home because they want something more, new, better, differet. Tens of THOUSANDS of young and not-so-young Irish people have emigrated out of Ireland in the past couple of years, as the country is in such bad economic trouble right now. You can be damn sure that if people leave for 'just' economic reasons, they'll definitely also leave if they feel restricted or persecuted just for being themselves.
Do you know how many Malaysians - and Singaporeans, and Chinese, and others - I've met in London who left Home because they're gay, and because they felt unable to live their lives at Home? And especially true for Malaysians!
Gay or Straight, people live on the other side of the planet from Home, if the new country, people, culture and way gives them the life that they want, and the freedom or opportunities that they want. And THAT would be why a Malaysian man might, just might, choose to live in Ireland with another man - because as messed up as our country is, and as challenging as it is for Anyone and Everyone to live here, now, at least he would have more freedom to live the life that He wanted, here. He can still be a Muslim, still eat Malaysian food, still meet other Malaysians, etc etc. We even have education here! (Which Might go to explain the large numbers of Malaysian male and female students here at medical college in the city centre.)
I could go on, but the point is made. My country is awful at many things - BUT, in providing some equality to gay men and women, it's better than Malaysia. And That, I presume, is why He, and the Other gay Malaysians I've met here, are Here, even if it's just Ireland...
From the articles, we all know that it's highly possible that he is reportedly missing by his own father. Nobody could ever imagine how hard it could be for him not to be able to get in touch with his family. His father might be the one who disown him at first because they had a disagreement. We all never know the real story behind, but one thing I'm sure of, it's not easy for him. He has the courage to pursue what he wants in life, and he found it. If you are gay and you live in Asian country or you have an Asian partner, I'm sure you will understand what he is going through.
Malaysia gov is exaggerating the topic. Same-sex relationship is illegal, but isn't discrimination and prejudice also against human's rights? Being gay isn't a choice. Coming out as a gay is a tough road for every guy who wants the equal social treatment. The extreme homophobic countries makes life harder for them. Don't blame Asian who moves to western countries to get married. They are more open-minded and know how to accept a human better as a human being. Sexual orientation is a personal thing, if they get punishment for that, it is really against morale. Don't treat us like an animal.
I hope he doesn't have to go back to Malaysia and live happily ever after in Ireland :)
Equally as a result of this education and now permanent residence in Ireland he will be in a position to repay it over time - it is not clear if he was studying medicine or nursing but either will provide a reasonable income.
Very naive of him to allow such a provocative photo to appear on the net with his name - look at the reaction of the bigots in PBIK. The result of their bigotry is likely to be the separation of a family. Whatever other results of this unwanted publicity he may well have to stay away from his home. He must have known that the photo would have provided a heaven sent opportunity for such inhuman reaction.
Hopefully this will provide extra glue to keep the relationship going through the inevitable difficulties -good luck to them
is it a right thing to: go study, not doing well with studies, dropped his studies, forgot about the scholarship and left it to your parents to settle it? Ariff has the right to get married, that makes him happy, i am very happy for him when i first saw the pictures but why he put aside his problems to other people. if he want want to go back to study after this, thats good for him... but i guess... he have to make sure it is a good investment.
I live in malaysia; i am enough of people calling gays are disgusting, but calling gays ungrateful, just into themselves, selfish, etc are just way too much because we most of us are not like that. Called me homophobic, do i care? i don't know you and you don't know me.
peace
ps: pay your own debt
You believe that Arif is an irresponsible person, never think about his family and the consequences of his marriage to a man in Ireland? We, the third party do not know the real truth. The media is just out to paint him as an irresponsible, selfish person. Don't believe that. For all you know, he has plans to pay back the money he borrowed once he start working.
The bottom line is, he is brave enough to seek out his happiness in the face of all the obstacles. How many of us can do the same?
For that, he deserves encouragement and salutes.
As it happens, I'm a journalist AND an editor - not only do I check Very carefully that what the Newsdesk guys write is factually correct, but they, and the News Editor, and the Group Editor, care very much about being both correct And fair.
Not every journalist or paper is like this - and the few that aren't tend to be the ones that are constantly sued, fined and publicly apologizing. But most - Most - journalists care very much about what The Facts are, just as most Subs (the unsung heroes of publishing, who both see, check and fix what journalists write) and Editors do.
So, don't blame The Media for everything! ;-)
"When you think about gay relationship, no matter how passionate it is from the very beginning, no one knows the ending."
That says a Lot about that author's latent homophobia, in the context of the rest of his remarks. A Lot. There's no point getting into a "My country's better than Your country" argument, as Both sides would win And lose, easily.
However, it's hard not to notice, yet again, a subtle anti-gay air to some of the remarks, above - always a curious thing to notice coming from 'gay' members of a Gay website...
Can't you tell from the tenor of those howling him down that this is all about religion and how they want everyone to live by their rules and to hell with the individuals rights and how dare he be gay and they want to lash out and punish him by asking for the money back.
There is NOTHING in the article that suggests he defrauded anyone.
Hello Muslim groups - he is NOT in your perverted mind-fucked country so why should he adhere to your obnoxious Islamic laws that would jail him for being human. I wish all of you crazy people all the most miserable lives possible to match your miserable minds.
We all need to love and be loved - isn't this why Ariff made the choices he made? I wish Ariff and his Irish partner much happiness.
Some writers ask ridiculous questions like "will he be happy" or "will the relationship last"? So homophobic! Do you ask the same of hetero relationships? Do you say straight people should not marry in case the marriage might end in divorce?
Of course not.
Following one's heart into a relationship that may not last is everyone's chance to take - though some countries/cultures put more obstacles in the way of happiness than others.
As a group gay people need to show some understanding for the hardships this Malaysian man has endured and wish him and his husband all the best.
Don't sell your heart to the oppressors. Don't buy the nonsense that the condemnation is about money. Chances are that this young man is demonstrating by his courage that he is a man of integrity - he is certainly more honest to his own needs than a few men I have met from Malaysia who have married women and need to travel to neighboring countries for sexual relief (and I try not to judge them negatively for this, as I am not in their shoes - though severe judgment for causing this behavior must fall on the laws and culture).
I suspect our medical student has plans to repay the obligation anyway.
可悲可叹啊！！
http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2011/12/21/nation/20111221112701&sec=nation
"He, however, declined to comment on whether he had a civil partnership or was involved in a same-sex relationship."
So this the young man that are supposedly honest, brave, proud, and with intergrity - i guess he is still confused or unsure with what he is doing.
You use a newspaper report (which is clearly homophobic) to asert a man who has just got married is confused. Can't you see how infected you are with homophobia? I guess not. You're entitled to be in denial and join the chorus of Moslems who wish to condemn a gay man for following his dreams.
Don't you know being gay is not a positive quality in Malaysia?
Can't you see the scholarship is a ruse to condemn gay people?
Do you read the papers in Malaysia?
Don't you know this kind of scandal does not arise when a straight man drops out of studies and has to repay a scholarship? That leads to civil liability not moral outrage.
His whereabouts are known. If he is liable to repay the loan (which he should not if the reason they are pulling it is because he is gay), then he could reach agreement on terms and repay over 20-30 years or whatever is the usual period. I'm sure he is not the first student to drop out (if he has) and I am sure this is dealt with routinely. The issue is his gayness and nastiness of the culture as he strives for happiness.
While the issue of not paying off scholarships are common, the fact that he is gay does make the papers put him under a microscope. At the end of the day, it so does not make it any better for us over here.
Dispatches From the Fault Line Between Christianity and Islam
By Eliza Griswold
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/22/books/review/Robinson-t.html
truly a scary situation, however i think this publication may not be available in malaysia... why oh why must religion be a power struggle ????
Living in a society that is unfair to gay people places the acts of gay people under greater scrutiny but, in this case, there may not be a financial loss - you are buying the biased reporting of journalists in a biased society. Student loans/failed scholarships are usually paid off over many years, and in the case of "ordinary people", repayment is sometimes even waived for good cause. If Malaysia were a welcome place for the student to have returned and lived a happy and free life, he would likely have made a different life choice about his studies and where to live. But neither his society nor his father seem to make that possible - and for that he gets the blame and many gay Malaysians here have no sympathy or understanding. WOW!
Nevertheless, I hope that the Malaysians who are fearing negative consequences for their community (and I am sure you are correct to do so as any possible reason to be nasty to gays will be used by homophobes - whether fair, justified, or not), can see how differently people from more free societies are able to view this case.
We call it Stockholm Syndrome when hostages start to see the world through the eyes of their captors. In Malaysia your gayness is held hostage and coming out is commonly a limited and difficult process for fear of negative consequences.
Gay people in such situations are often thankful they are not treated worse (i.e. we're lucky we're able to party and have fun and are not killed off like the Taliban or other Islamic nations might - so let's just behave and hope they leave us alone.)
Well, those of us who live in freeer societies, where we consider ourselves equal to other people do not kow-tow as easily any more. (We used to - our societies have been there.)
I apologise if anything I have said appears to judge you negatively for how you handle your plight...my point in writing is hoping that you will find inspiration in the words of your freeer gay brethren, to at least be fair and supportive to a countryman who is being scandalized because he chose to act on his gay feelings.
Joining the Islamic chorus condemns yourselves...you will not be considered good because you criticise other gay people. In the eyes of homophobes you will be tarred yourselves.
Dividing gay people suits homophobes. You know nothing in the media proves this guy is a bad person...if you cannot give him the benefit of the doubt, who can? If he is scared to speak out, you know it's the intolerant culture and religion that makes it difficult.
Possible Archbishop Tutu was right when he said: "People have never been given their freedom, they have to take it themselves." Stand proud and don't let Malaysia confound "gay" with "crook". It's not right.
Malaysia is a nice country. Love visiting KL, however, many ethnicities are second class citizens exempli gratia: Ethnic Chinese et..al.
It is sad that a beautiful country has to resort to this kind of actions. SIGHS.
Ariff is straight, a non-Muslim, breaks his scholarship (not saying he has done so as the current news is not conclusive), marries an Irish lady, in the process falls out with his mother, and decides to stay in Ireland for a better life.
How would this story have made it to the press? Is your guess thes same as mine? - Never. It will be one too many of similar cases that the editor will chug into his bin for more important news.
Assuming it did get a press release by all miracles, how would society (straight and gay) have reacted? Perhaps same as mine?
- Marries an Irish lady: that's his business, but congratulations if he finds true love
- Breaks his scholarship: that's his business; many people have done that; let the usual recovery process kick in to address this
- Falls out with his mother - again that's his business; he's just one of the million people who have relationship issues with family members
- Implicates his family in the scholarship: not a wise thing to do; but that's their business; I'm sure they will sort it out; did Ariff say he will not pay?; no, so I'm sure the will sort it out
Would your reaction be somewhat similar to mine? Do you think society might generally dismiss it in the same way?
If yes, contrast it with the current outpour, and there you go ... Homosexuality and anti-gay religion are a potent mix to blow things out of proportion. Unfortunately, it does not happen to just one side of the fence. It happens to our side of the fence too!
Media bias happens everywhere, my address in this situation is with the idea of how irresponsible someone can be with a scholarship (890k worth of it) and leaving someone else to clear the debt.
I'm all for happy unions of any kind (that does not involve paedophilia or anything of that consistency). The fact that he is gay throws another curve ball to the people that are still here fighting for the cause. While am happy for the union, I don't see the point of letting someone (if it's true this happened) like him get away with not paying for the scholarship and leaving his own family in the lurch.
This is not so much of a kow-tow. It's more of how we that are still here are being perceived, when some of us are trying to push societal inclusion.
That you do not hold the father responsible for anything amazes me. You should know how unreasonable the homophobia of some people is...and they bear more than equal responsibility for the dysfunction it causes. Why do you insist on buying the "blame the victim" stuff?
You act like it's so easy to find love and that it can be planned to wait until your studies are over. Have you never felt passion? Are you so sure you would never take a chance for love?
Are you so sure you are better than him?
We are talking about the act of not paying violating the scholarship terms and not being in reach for three years and letting someone else clean the mess.
I personally don't care if it's straight or gay issue. If someone acts irresponsibly and expects another to clean up after them, it is not acceptable in any book.
Like I said and have stated multiple times, my thoughts apply on the basis that the act of him dropping out of school and being out of contact and not paying his scholarship back to Petronas and having the family pay the money is true from the article above.
A person can change his/her mind if they want to. However, if they accept a conditional offer and form a contract of agreement in which they potentially violate, it is their OWN responsibility to bear the consequences not anyone else's.
What is the father responsible for? Lodging a missing persons report for a son he's been searching for? Apparently finding one's own son that's gone missing is a bad thing.
I do not condone excusing someone for letting someone else clean up his/her own mess. Just because I'm gay doesn't mean I'll support everyone gay guy blindly even if he's done something wrong. Wrong is wrong even if it's for love.
Ariff as a human being, in my opinion, is entitled to be happy, to marry anyone he wish to marry
Petronas the scholarship department or the company has the right to ask for their return of the investment
Ariff's family has the right not to be involved with the problem.
I am happy for both of them, obviously, to be married is a very big step to do, for either hetero or gay community. It is a forever commitment to one person only.
Arif also made a prior commitment with Petronas, he would finish his study and return back home.
Now, clearly he has decided to break the commitment AND MADE A CHOICE to be with his husband. I totally understand the feeling when you met the one that you want to spend the rest of your life with.
However, in my opinion, when you make a choice, you have to accept the consequence of the impact that you make when you made the decision. Alright, he is from a muslim background, and majority muslim country. As an adult, he should understand that if this is his decision, the possibility not to see his family or return to his country is very big.
With Petronas, I don't see why his family has to be responsible to pay for whatever his owing (according to them anyway). We don't know what sort of contract or scholarship that Arif has, most probably there are some points that mentioned he should return to Malaysia and serve the company etc....but nobody knows exactly what sort of contract he has, in my opinion, IT IS NOT OUR PLACE TO JUDGE this person since we don't know him personally and the details of the agreement.
I think, Petronas should be able to come to an agreement with Ariff in term of what sort of "price" he has to pay instead of asking him to pay the full amount which I think most people would not have. Ariff may complete his course, and find a job and pay back his scholarship within certain years agreement etc.
It is a beautiful thing when two persons decided to commit to each other forever, Ariff that is your decision, you chose to be in this, so, be fair to every parties, and accept all the consequences and your responsibilities.
For his marriage I congratulate him!
I say all power to this man who has married the man he loves.
We can only hope that their will be a change of leadership in Malaysia after the next election, though that won't be easy... given the very active 'dirty tricks' department that will cheat to stay in power!
And Ariff, ALL THE BEST to you and your new man :)
And your story is really moving,too...I'll remember it always. :')
You may protest that Ariff has broken a valid law while you have broken an invalid law (in your opinion), but the straight people will still see you as pots calling the kettle black. You have all broken a law, one way or another. See the hypocrisy we get into by being so forthright in inflicting the law? But sorry, this is just a teaser, hehe, and not my main point.
My main point is simply this:
Do you believe reports coming from an institution that is anti-gay by law and anti-gay by religion as somewhat biased? Do you think you should take the incriminating comments with not just a pinch of salt, but many tablespoons of salt?
Did you make an effort to read the other contradicting reports such as the Irish Times? Perhaps it is biased too, but did you make an effort to read and take stock of both sides?
So while one report says Ariff was MIA for 3 years, the other report says he was in contact with his family members and authorities all this while. While one report says he has burdened his family with compensation responsibilities, the otehr report says he has all along been engaging Petronas privately on repayment arrangements.
Against contradicting reports, can we stay neutral till conclusive evidence comes up (if it ever comes up)? If not, which side we take speaks a lot about us as gay individuals.
The camp that supports Ariff chooses to see the inspiring side of the story. It's about a gay Muslim braving all odds to be with his love. Believe me, against a persecuting religion towards gays, (in some countries deadly persecuting), it is ten-fold more difficult for a gay Muslim to do what Ariff has done than any individual of other creeds. And that is why this camp has been trying to point out; that this positive message shines through the pile of inconclusive evidence.
The other camp bitches about the incriminating evidence as if it is proven beyond doubt given the guilty verdict that is laden everywhere in their content. Some, like DarkEstacy, used a few "ifs" but almost all his content smacks of a guilty verdict on Ariff. A very thin disguise, really. How about a few "if not's"? How about devoting half the content to saying his views if the incriminating evidence is not true? What is his take on the inspiring side of the story?
I suddenly recall an old English proverb: none so blind as those who won't see.
I can see why they do not live in Malaysia and I can see why many tourists leave Malaysia off the list of places to visit.
If gays are second class citizens there so are women and other minorities. Many tourists would not feel safe there.
Those red necks are probably happy to live in their little bubble breathing only hatred for others. If they didn't have minorities to criticize and bully they would just turn on each other.
I certainly will not be visiting " simply awful Malaysia " until it begins to treat people fairly.
Worthy lesson to Malaysia Officials- planting gay hatred?
Haha, then PAY FOR IT!
Well done, boys! And best of luck! :)
i used to get these letters where i lived, as my partner had a student loan. the malaysian gov't sends a demand for payment about every six months and he and other malays who aren't intending to return there just bin the letters without a second thought.
this makes me wonder whether scholarship providers are in the habit of making the family pay even if they have to go guarantor to get a loan in the first place.
it further makes me wonder if the story is a beat-up, and it wouldn't have been news had not PBIK made a complaint.
remember the government in malaysia is on the nose for corruption issues, and it would be no surprise to see bodies associated with the government looking for scapegoats. question: is PBIK such a body?
i used to get these letters where i lived, as my partner had a student loan. the malaysian gov't sends a demand for payment about every six months and he and other malays who aren't intending to return there just bin the letters without a second thought.
this makes me wonder whether scholarship providers are in the habit of making the family pay even if they have to go guarantor to get a loan in the first place.
it further makes me wonder if the story is a beat-up, and it wouldn't have been news had not PBIK made a complaint.
remember the government in malaysia is on the nose for corruption issues, and it would be no surprise to see bodies associated with the government looking for scapegoats. question: is PBIK such a body?
u are talkig about millions of dollars in lost revenue if more travellers did it!
u are talking about millions of dollars in lost revenue if more travellers did it!
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